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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    8

    Default HR Consultant or Manager role wanted in Melbourne

    Have had 10 great years as HR Generalist, Change Projects and Business Unit People Leader. Then resigned from my last role as I had a baby and was relocating to Melbourne. I'm not even getting interviews as I attempt to return to the workforce. Have been advised by an agency that my resume is good, however businesses ask them for RECENT experience so it would be unlikely that agencies would shortlist me. I was shocked! Not sure if there is discrimination out there regarding me having a young child .... I state that I had a baby as my reason for leaving my last role - I also try and let it be known that there is full time daddy day care and that I rarely take any days off work, just in case that is an issue.

    Am mainly applying for consultant level roles, have great referees and a passion for Performance Development, Relationship Management, Leadership programs and Change.

    Any suggestions?

  2. #2

    Default

    Firstly my advice is not rely to much on agency's. They are flooded and the chance of you getting anywhere with them is slim. I advocate strongly for approaching the employers directly. Make a list of 20 or so companies you would truly want to work for. Make a list of what value you could add to the business with your skills and knowledge.......then put on a comfortable pair of shoes and hit the pavement.

    Your family situation should not come into play at all.....and if it does give me a call.....been a while since I've done a good adverse action claim.....

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    2

    Default

    Sounds like a lot of pain...have you thought about going out on your own and leveraging off your HR expertise.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Thank you QLD IR consultant, I think you are right - and for anyone reading this who is in a similar boat, many years ago I researched companies, rang to find out names and title, sent out 22 letters and got 6 interviews - and was successful for one of those. I had very little experience then and it worked. This time I thought with all the experience I could easily find something.

    And thank you Rec AC.....yes I have thought about going out on my own and if this next lot of letters doesn't work, it could be earlier than I think!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    452

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Determined View Post
    This time I thought with all the experience I could easily find something.
    More experience usually equates to more seniority and unfortunately the more senior you become the fewer the number of opportunities.

    There are many unemployed HR people out there so there's a lot of competition for the positions that come up.

    Casualisation of the workforce has increased markedly in recent years, as it usually does in uncertain economic conditions and our employment legislation has also been a contributing factor.

    A significant percentage of HR positions are contract nowadays, and it's common to see "contract to perm" positions. This is basically employers taking advantage of the market conditions. Even if it's not advertised as "contract to perm" that is what often happens.

    Bear in mind most contract positions are advertised through agencies, so I certainly wouldn't shun recruiters because one individual thought I was out of the market for too long. Try some more.

    How long is it since you left your last position?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    8

    Default

    How long is it since you left your last position?[/QUOTE]

    Left last position April 2011.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    452

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Determined View Post
    How long is it since you left your last position?

    Left last position April 2011.
    Less than two years. That really shouldn't be an issue.

  8. #8

    Default

    The hardest part is getting past the agency to get an interview. They make the decision as to whether or not you fit the brief from the client. Which in some cases the client isn't 100% sure of who they want either....

    easiest way around the agency is take them out of the equation and do it yourself....A lot of work but it should pay off.....

    Good Luck!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    452

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qld IR Consultant View Post
    The hardest part is getting past the agency to get an interview.
    Really? So all you need to do is get past the agency and you get the job?

    That's your advice?

    In reality the agency will put forward a number candidates whom they believe fit the client's brief, and only one of them will get the job.

    They make the decision as to whether or not you fit the brief from the client.
    Of course they do, that's their job!

    If a recruiter sends me every candidate who thought they were right for the job I wouldn't be dealing with the recruiter for very long.

    Which in some cases the client isn't 100% sure of who they want either....
    That happens for sure - we don't live in a perfect world. A good recruiter will ask questions to ascertain exactly what the client want, but some times it only comes out of the process, when the client starts interviewing candidates and gives the recruiter feedback.

    Bear in mind also, that some hiring managers use recruiters to do their discrimination for them.

    Ageism is common nowadays. I have also experienced blatant racial discrimination (thankfully not so common). But there are more subtle things that the employer would not want to advertise, like trying to achieve gender balance in a department or team. Or the opposite, when a manager only hires candidates of a particular gender.

    There is even sub-conscious discrimination, like managers (and recruiters) who never interview candidates who have a name that is hard to pronounce.

    There will of course be some managers out there who don't want to hire someone with a young child. I've even heard grumblings from a manager who didn't want to hire anyone who might become pregnant!

    There is all manner of discrimination going on, but don't expect the recruiter to tell you because they're usually doing someone elses bidding.

    The upshot of this is that there are often decision factors that are not advertised or mentioned by the recruiter, sometimes because it would be illegal to do so.

    easiest way around the agency is take them out of the equation and do it yourself
    And kiss goodbye to a large percentage of temp/contract jobs and even some permanent jobs!

    There are many organisations who may do their permanent staff recruitment themselves, but employ all of their temp/contract staff through agencies. There are also some who also do the bulk of their perm recruitment through agencies, for a variety of reasons.

    There are undoubtedly some situations where the recruiter gets it wrong, and rejects someone whom the client would hire, but it's not as common an occurrence as some would suggest.

    DETERMINED, as it is you who is looking for a job, and not Qld IR Consultant, my advice would be to keep talking to recruiters while you continue to make direct applications. You should soon be able to work out which recruiters know what they are talking about and who are genuinely willing to consider you for positions where they feel you could be a good fit.

    I can guarantee you that not all HR recruiters will feel that less than two years out of the market is too long!

  10. #10

    Default

    Lets agree to disagree Moz. I researched for 2 years on HR and IR recruitment in this country, hence the reason why I now run my own. I'm not saying that they are all like that, but when you have a couple of bad experiences it black marks it for everyone. The bulk of agencies I have dealt with fail in one critical aspect and thats treating the candidates as clients as well as the employers themselves.

    My advice as requested would be simple....try the agencies first, if that fails then do it yourself and see the difference. Recruitment agencies aren't the be all and end all of finding a job and people shouldn't be lulled into thinking that they are.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    NSW
    Posts
    65

    Default

    Determined

    I agree with Qld IR Consultant regarding recruitment agencies. I wouldn't rule them out completely but they will 'cull' you based on your time away from the workforce if the client does not want it. They are not the be all and end all of finding you are job.

    My second issue is - what do you put on your CV? I hope it's maternity leave or carers leave and no mention of your child or childcare arrangements. That's nobody's business and I wouldn't be offering it as a topic of conversation either. That same question is NEVER asked of a man which I have a real issue with. I took time out of the workforce for 12 months due to a family issue and I put carers leave on my CV. I had no problem getting interviews or jobs. If they asked I told them the basics. Not the whole story. None of their business. The company I currently work for the MD in the interview asked me about my husband!!! I literally told him 'not that I have to tell you but because your interested he's a Senior Counsel'! Then i went about giving him some serious interview techniques when i started. Perhaps that's why I got the job but nevertheless they are the questions you shouldn't answer nor have to justify you have everything under control on the home front.

    You are a HR Professional so weeding out the agencies or companies that ask these kinds of questions should be a breeze and as mentioned a possible adverse action claim!

    Remember - those same agencies that discriminate or treat you badly are the same ones who will come running when you are the HR Manager in a company!!

    Good luck.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Hi NicoleAnita

    Thanks for the feedback. I just put 'had a baby' as reason for leaving. But when I am speaking with acquaintances about possibilities (note that I write 'acquaintances' as I never get interviews!), I sometimes let it be known that there is daddy day care. I know it's none of their business, nor an employer's business, however, I also know that sometimes it can be an issue. Some are once bitten twice shy.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    NSW
    Posts
    65

    Default

    Just one suggestion - I would change it to Maternity Leave. Putting 'had a baby' already opens up the questions like 'how old is your child etc' in interviews. That would probably be their opening line therefore leading into your next issue with day care. All I would say is 'I am now in a position to resume full time work'. End of story. That should be sufficient information.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Thanks and yes I will do that....although I never took mat leave, I resigned as I was leaving the area anyway.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Melbourne - Fitzroy
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Moz View Post

    A significant percentage of HR positions are contract nowadays, and it's common to see "contract to perm" positions. This is basically employers taking advantage of the market conditions. Even if it's not advertised as "contract to perm" that is what often happens.
    So this is legal Moz? Not a sham contract?

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